While concealed, player heals cannot target me. However, if I conceal myself and npc guards heal, it reveals me.

makes domain combat extremely annoying.

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Well you have to consider that AI mobs can also LOCK ON to you when your INVISIBLE. If we take away the guards revealing you when they heal, we also need to alter the all omnipotent monster AI to not be able to follow you when you are concealed.

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I think it's ok that guard's heal removes conceal.

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remove status spells and make life not usuable on PVP kills.

will make pvp much less gay.

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If making it so heal doesn't hit you while concealed is too complicated, make it so getting hit with heal doesn't reveal you.

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1) Exo that has nothing to do with this topic....in the slightest.

2) Enn guards seeing you (cause they all have 20/5 vision) while conceal is fine, it's the fact that my own guards keep revealing me when I'm trying to go out to defend the domain.

3) Nab I don't see how you think that's okay. It screws up people attempting to actually defend the town (with a less direct approach) rather than hide behind ridiculously overpowered army units until the attackers lose interest or get ganked.

4) making it so conceal doesn't get removed by heal would also means taking damage wouldn't reveal you either wouldn't it?


None of which are the actual problem. The guards shouldn't be TARGETTING a concealed PC with heal.

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if you remove status spells(including conceal) then this problem becomes non-existent. =]

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If making it so heal doesn't hit you while concealed is too complicated, make it so getting hit with heal doesn't reveal you.

basically ezao suggest you can cure concealed people.

thats what i called stupid.

i agree we should ignore all of exo's posts by the way.

also if heal wont target concealed people, eventually a suggestion will come up with "heal SHOULD cure concealed people becuase i died while concealed becuase heal didnt hit me!"

and then someone would say "yes that sounds good, as long as it also reveals you, to be balanced."

everyone would agree and it would be put in again.



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We could make just the guard's heal not hit you when you're concealed? I personally think it would make more sense for it not to hit you when concealed, since when you're concealed, nothing else can target you, so why heal?

Either guard's heal shouldn't reveal you or heal shouldn't work on you while concealed. Although I don't see too big a deal with heal alone still hitting you while concealed and not revealing you.

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basically ezao suggest you can cure concealed people.

Wrong, I'm just saying guards should be able to target concealed players with heal and not reveal them.

Your grammar is terrible btw.

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so keep the conceal but heal ok?
also exo, death sickness after being lifed and kilt over and over is all the reason life shouldnt be taken away in pvp, too

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the spell that guards have is the same that players have.

gaku isnt going to add a special heal for guards that ignores conceal because of a tiny convenience.

notice that gaku doesn't add shit like this because some guy just doesnt like it.

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also if heal wont target concealed people, eventually a suggestion will come up with "heal SHOULD cure concealed people becuase i died while concealed becuase heal didnt hit me!"

Clicking yourself would reveal you however, there's also a turf casted cure or cure 2 so if you die while concealed your WW/RW is a moron, and you didn't really help yourself either.

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I myself always wondered why conceal did not work on monsters this version. That makes no sense to me whatsoever. What is the point of the spell then?

But I digress.

I think that 'All allied/enemy target' spells, AKA Heal, Lock2, or any others that may exist, should NOT effect someone concealed.

In addition to being balanced, I'm going to open the pandora's box of 'it makes sense' here, so bare with me.

If I can't see you, and I throw a fireball next to you by happenstance. Me not seeing you will not save you from the fire. If I aim to heal all of my allies in my sight, and I can't see you, then how would I know to target you? It's a risky kind of logic because this is a game, and games don't have to make sense, I just want to justify the balancing action with a rational explanation.

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To be fair, the wizard probably doesn't visually see everyone when he casts heal or lock. That would probably be feeling them somehow or something.

But I agree with Lumino's idea. It need to go one way or the other, not stay how it is.

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It's my humble view that Conceal was a spell that got gimped to hell and back when it wasn't even that amazing. I mean, look at all the disadvantages it has.

-Uses an element slot on a fairly uncommon element (For Anti's that is important), and not terribly useful mid combat.

-No longer hides from NPCs or Guards, restricted to PvP.

-Destroyed by Lamp, Torches or Braziers.

-Can be targeted by party wide spells and be dispelled by such.

+Can cast spells while concealed.

In my view, numbers 2, 4 and 5 should be changed.

To summarize. Make it so it DOES hide you from NPCs, CANNOT be targeted by Party Wide Spells, and you CANNOT take action while invisible without it dropping.

I think those are fine solutions.

Oh wait wait wait. No changes to an outdated version. Well then consider this recommendations for when it is added to Terulia.

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lights dont remove conceal

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Abilities not being usable while concealed would kill a lot of its usefuless, in my opinion. Otherwise you could use it to sneak by enemy lines, but in FFO, how often does that situation present itself.

At least maybe if it fooled guards you could get deep into enemy domains before revealing yourself, I guess.

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Now that I think of it, heal is like a curative wave coming out of the caster that heals all targets, invisible or not. It doesn't really matter who you see, the factor is whether or not the party member is within range of your spell.

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gaku said a while back that if your prof for vanish or conceal are high enough then monsters will have a greater chance to not see you. i don't think i've ever seen that happen.

krank, whoever you are, what's the point of stomping your opponent's face into the ground if they can still be res'd when you're out of sight? i don't know about you guys but i kill people in FFO to inconvenience them and i don't mean the few minutes they need to wait for a WW to arrive to life them.

ffo pvp right now = this... everyone uses conceal, if available, to fight. someone dies? conceal a WW so they can life them. start losing? retreat to a town THEN conceal a WW so they can life them.

basically whoever loses conceal first is status spell'd and then stomped into the ground. ffo has a history of whoever uses the right status spells first wins in PVP. it's still true even though they have been nerfed greatly. berserk lasts forever, owns casters, and it seems as though it's not affected by enchantment resistance even though people claim it is. even if it is, its duration is so long that it really doesn't even matter. mute is like it but doesn't last as long.

i've been off playing WoW for a while and i came back last night to do a little pvp because i thought it would be fun. it was horribly boring. i experienced the relatively same scenario ten thousand times.

status spells need to be changed or removed. i know locke wants the same thing except he thinks all WWs should get conceal, BWs should get fast, and RWs should get slow. i personally think conceal ruins the fun of pvp, along with life. fast isn't that bad unless the BW is in speed or accels, but if none of the other mages get perks... slow has the same problem many of the status spells do. enchantment resistance doesn't rise nearly as fast as it should.

if status spells are kept then they should only last a few seconds each. the durations should be cut in half if cast in succession and after the third cast the target should be immune to it. conceal should be self cast only. if it was like this, the status spells(except berserk) could be reverted to their old mechanics for the most part. or not. it wouldn't matter all that much.

i would personally rather see them removed, but mages may be just a little too vulnerable in pvp if they are. it would be nice to see people use a little bit more skill for once instead of always looking for the next "insta-win button".

and now i'll leave people like nabutso to say how i'm posting in the wrong thread, the idea is stupid, blah blah blah etc. i really don't care. if gaku wants it in the suggestions section or whatever i'll oblige but otherwise i don't give a shit.

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