Shane wrote:

Locke wrote:

I can explain why no one wants to live in Tristram. Aside from the fact its never been very accessible before so players won't think of it and GsH is easier because more people are already there:

Its right between a really hard/annoying cave and a dock. GsH is on the corner of a huge, wide open training area that very few players can do if need be. It'd be like if you had to go through the top two floors of the Ruins to get to Sank.

Yes, which is why I wanted to talk to Gaku about maybe changing the spawns around Tristram to be a bit more friendly.

The landmass would need to be changed too. The area between the docks and ice cave is too small. Irendi just isn't set up for training the same way Vorg is. I don't think any Irendi mobs really need to change, but a path around the ice cave would be nice.

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Marcus wrote:

Its not just the spawns around tristram, its alot of irendi mobs, Icicles might need halved profs like we did with the spell caster mobs. and the melee mobs might need to be toned down since they can knock off half of a weaker players health in a single hit compared to on vorg where that weaker players survival chance is way higher.

Maybe most of the problem here is just difficulty and adapting.

No it's not, it's whom ever gets spoon fed equipment and can survive retardedly over powered mobs. A single hit from ONE icicle can do more than half the health of any non health suffixed mage. Now imagine a swarm of three plus a few trolls, like usual. You'd be lucky to even run through there, let alone survive to the next floor, where, IMAGES are waiting to screw your face off with the spam of dark 2. I'm just lucky I had -some- shade gear the other day, I took a few steps onto the 2nd floor of ice caves and spawned 5 shades. If you don't have tons of health or tons of elemental gear in your inventory (Which is very limited in space) then you're ****ed going through these places. And Armor takes up space and weight, causing you to move slower and which ends up getting you killed too most of the time. I know these places arnt meant to be soloed, but they shouldn't be so retardedly impossible to get through without 600+ health and elemental gear. (Cause trolls hit hard too.)

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Wait, why are we all of a sudden trying to balance domains now? I was always under the impression that they were supposed to have their built in inequalities. In fact, I recall Gaku saying this exact thing to me when I complained about the huge rock taking up a lot of prime Sankoran real-estate.

I mean, as far as I can see, domains are spreading and populating a lot quicker than previous 4.0 hostings, which to me suggests that GsH isn't gonna have the 400 people living there that it has the last few hostings (which were still more than spread out enough for the most part, the last hosting not withstanding).

So other than a few people mad nobody wants to live with them, is there like a REAL problem here?

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Marcus wrote:

I'll post tomarrow, gonna get some sleep.

...What.

Anyway, Irendi's mobs should not get weakened except maybe Images. It's difficulty is fine and would be a huge bummer if it was nerfed. Irendi shouldn't be changed for new players, but providing them with something that would entice more advanced players to move there would be another story. I mean, the great experience should be good enough as a player advances, but the domains definitely need some encouraging factors to draw players to them.

Gaku's idea about domain bonuses seemes great to me. You get more experience and wealth in Irendi, where you could increase the bonuses of your domain greater than a lowly domain could, enticing more advanced players to move there.

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DeshTheWraith wrote:

Wait, why are we all of a sudden trying to balance domains now? I was always under the impression that they were supposed to have their built in inequalities. In fact, I recall Gaku saying this exact thing to me when I complained about the huge rock taking up a lot of prime Sankoran real-estate.

I mean, as far as I can see, domains are spreading and populating a lot quicker than previous 4.0 hostings, which to me suggests that GsH isn't gonna have the 400 people living there that it has the last few hostings (which were still more than spread out enough for the most part, the last hosting not withstanding).

So other than a few people mad nobody wants to live with them, is there like a REAL problem here?

Exactly.

I kinda think that any of the updates to balance FFO since the pwipe that weren't directly related to testing for Terulia are pointless. They just caused for more updates being neccessary to rebalance other things, while leaving these updates out would leave us with mostly the same FFO as last hosting, which wasn't too broken. And really, its a game and we're supposed to have fun PLAYING it (right?) and not worry about some things being perfectly realistic or balanced. I understand what Gaku wants to do with Terulia, but FFO can just be what it has been before, and people who don't like it can suck it up and deal with it. (ie. level cap being reduced because people complained about knight health?)

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Level cap was reduced to make it more like Terulia and to make it easier for people to train up to the level of the top players, from what I hear.

Gaku's idea about domain bonuses seemes great to me. You get more experience and wealth in Irendi, where you could increase the bonuses of your domain greater than a lowly domain could, enticing more advanced players to move there.

This is how it was in 3.5 Bonuses made the Lords of those domains a lot stronger than normal. I don't remember all the downsides, but I think the general consensus is that it was a bad idea.

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Locke wrote:

Gaku's idea about domain bonuses seemes great to me. You get more experience and wealth in Irendi, where you could increase the bonuses of your domain greater than a lowly domain could, enticing more advanced players to move there.

This is how it was in 3.5 Bonuses made the Lords of those domains a lot stronger than normal. I don't remember all the downsides, but I think the general consensus is that it was a bad idea.

In Terulia, this would be an automatic bonus based on player counts, not like the old experience-investment system. This system wouldn't work in FFO.

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Locke wrote:

Level cap was reduced to make it more like Terulia and to make it easier for people to train up to the level of the top players, from what I hear.

Gaku's idea about domain bonuses seemes great to me. You get more experience and wealth in Irendi, where you could increase the bonuses of your domain greater than a lowly domain could, enticing more advanced players to move there.

This is how it was in 3.5 Bonuses made the Lords of those domains a lot stronger than normal. I don't remember all the downsides, but I think the general consensus is that it was a bad idea.

I wonder if it's possible to get to domain lord bonuses removed and set to the same bonuses as the citizens get.

Edit: Oh, nevermind. Gaku, would the bonuses have to be based on population? It might be better to do the experience investments in Terulia so that players aren't encouraged to flock to specific domains to increase bonuses.

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Now that most of these argued details are irrelevent, is it decided that the only update Gaku would implement regarding FFO Domain Crowding is the citizen cap, if at all?

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Dawn wrote:

I wonder if it's possible to get to domain lord bonuses removed and set to the same bonuses as the citizens get.

Edit: Oh, nevermind. Gaku, would the bonuses have to be based on population? It might be better to do the experience investments in Terulia so that players aren't encouraged to flock to specific domains to increase bonuses.

As of right now, there are no bonuses in FFO, for citizens OR lords.

I think you have it backwards. The highest bonus will be for the kingdom with the lowest total population. As its population rises, the bonus would level out with the other kingdoms. On the other hand, a relatively overpopulated kingdom would have a net penalty.

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Thats not to say their stats would be lowered lower than their natural stats just because it has a higher population is it?

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Magnus Gallant wrote:

Thats not to say their stats would be lowered lower than their natural stats just because it has a higher population is it?

Probably not, but there are other ways to compensate.

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I just thin making a character weaker than the aer without any bonuses just because the domain is mor populates is unfair. buff a weaker domain sure but dont debuff a domain cuz it has more people.

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Wont this just make people block off their domains to the public so that they have more power than the other players? It seems like a real power gamer move imo.

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Bio Genocide wrote:

Wont this just make people block off their domains to the public so that they have more power than the other players? It seems like a real power gamer move imo.

There would be a few drawbacks to being the only person in a Domain though, too.

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Maybe you misread "kingdoms" as "domains". There's a difference.

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Domains and domain warfare is inherently flawed. The new formula that is being implemented will just be a "test". If it works then that's great, if it needs tweaks then im sure we can try to figure that out as a community.

The thing I don't see how this really works for Terulia is this. If overcrowding occurs in a Kingdom, how/why would the kingdom members leave said kingdom? If a new player would like to join "Kingdom A" will they be turned down because of over populaiton? What makes one kingdom more interesting to join than the others? Why do I care about the kingdom? Etc...

Also factor in the hardcore players and the casual players. The ones who are domain lords are the ones you place under "dedicated FFO players". When your not a lord you don't even log in as much and your goals are much more different.

If a person who was strong enough, or had a group that didn't care about domains, they can basically be "terrorists" which really is what Black did last version. Im all in for such behaviour because in FFO you are givin the choice to either be "bad" or "good" yet these types of players have too much advantage in creating chaos. (Sorry off topic)

Domains in FFO are too numerous now and choices are plenty, so regardless of what people like to say or think people will stay usually around Vorgardia because it's the easiest for the time being now that gives to most profit over time spent there. Also real "newbies" go there so that's usually the spot you will find new people to meet. If your only a "casual" player you will most likely only stay in GsH. Some people don't progress far into the game to enjoy the other benifits such as becoming a domain leader, or dedicate all their time in finding the most epic gear, or maxxed out proffs.


When you give FFO 1-2 months from now are some people have good WW's you'll see more ruin training parties.

From 3-4 months from now, more people will have thier classes balanced out and gear to be able to take on FrDragon's more consistantly.

Then the higher levels will eventually get bored with what they have and either just randomly PK, or start grouping together to just burn domains down.

And the cycle goes on.

This is why im looking forward to Terulia. The FFO economy broke when people got "FFO Basically". A new system needs to be in place to change the whole game style and attitude.





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I have to say I'm in favor of a population cap, or I had an idea while reading that if the domain has a high population make the guards stats lower due to pc population, let's say a guard has 5k health at stock, and a domain has 100 cits give the guard 2k health and less dmg(may seem dramatic) but the domain would rely more on the players to defend it and the citz couldn't just sit back and watch the guards kill off any intruders, however pur a medium pop count like 20 where the guards have base stats and if a domain has less then that medium thew guards and army get buffed, this would prevent people from hoarding one domain, but if they did they would have to contribute to its defence instead of just sitting back watching the guards kill anything(the mages magic power can be lowered or raised too)

And in concern to ice caves I honestly believe it should be nerfed, I have my level 20 red wizard with decent elemental gear and above decent profs and I'm even highly skilled in irendi, but I cannot take 2 trolls and 3 icicles, 2 ice or water 2s takes me to almost no health and the trolls hit extremely hard for the new health stats, not only that but its nearly impossible to get lucky enough to run due to ice caves first floor having only multi-tile mobs that spawn and having 4 spots potentially where they could block you off and if you're unfortunate enough to spawn 3 or more you spend 90% of your time. Healing with no chance to attack and with troll crits its basically game over no matter what

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As of right now, there are no bonuses in FFO, for citizens OR lords.

I think you have it backwards. The highest bonus will be for the kingdom with the lowest total population. As its population rises, the bonus would level out with the other kingdoms. On the other hand, a relatively overpopulated kingdom would have a net penalty.

Yeah, I know there is no bonuses now. You're right, though, I had it backwards. I thought you meant the bonuses would be higher for a more populated domain. Having the less populated domains have higher bonuses is a great idea to encourage people to live there, but Jeebs does have a good point about how easily someone greedy could block the domain from recruiting simply because they want to keep the high bonuses.

I don't think that should keep the idea from being implemented, though. If people don't like that someone is being greedy with a domain then warn them of the consequences and eventually take action.

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