Armies are totally OP right now. I agree an army shouldn't be weak, but an army by itself shouldn't be a total defense. The citizens should have to supplement the army.

I'd say like at least a 40% reduction in army scaling.

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Could you perhaps post how many people, and what classes you were using to try and take the army down, along with what the army makeup seemed to be?

It'd help make your point much more viable when we know just what matchup is going on, instead of just hearing "this is OP, fix now."

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Was done before last hosting. The scans of the army units themselves revealed that they are overly high in level etc.

Also, we had a 12+ person party. Multiple WW, RW with a BW and multiple Melee classes.

All CC'd


Like I said, the army shouldn't be a win all.
A domain should not be invincible or even close to it, ESPECIALLY, when no player characters are even on defending it.

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Perhaps a 15% lowering of their stats would prove sufficient? No sense almost halving their stats to make them easier to take down, best to do the nerfs on it slowly until we find the right point for it.

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Scanning Guard reveals the following:
Guard - level: 33
HP: 1102/1102 MP: 86/86
weak against air
weak against earth
weak against fire
weak against ice
weak against lit
weak against water
extremely weak against dark
resistant to light
resistant to poison

Scanning Ranger reveals the following:
Ranger - level: 47
HP: 2094/2094 MP: 183/183
weak against air
weak against earth
weak against fire
weak against ice
weak against lit
weak against water
extremely weak against dark
resistant to light
resistant to poison


Scanning Mage reveals the following:
Mage - level: 47
HP: 1395/1395 MP: 297/305
weak against air
weak against earth
weak against fire
weak against ice
weak against lit
weak against water
extremely weak against dark
resistant to light
resistant to poison


Scanning Soldier reveals the following:
Soldier - level: 44
HP: 1787/1828 MP: 125/125
weak against air
weak against earth
weak against fire
weak against ice
weak against lit
weak against water
extremely weak against dark
resistant to light
resistant to poison


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Which tier guard is that one you scanned?

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That was one of the weak guards. Not a captain.

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The world cap is lower now so guards aren't even that powerful any more. Have you tried it this hosting yet even?

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Those scans are from this hosting brah.

I scanned right before posting.

Reference Yizzy's most recent post here

Nab had a good idea.
Reduce the power of the army, along with the cost.
There's a threshold so if there's enough people on to actually take a domain, there should be enough people on to defend a domain. Armies need to be supplemental. It's already a pain in the ass to break through walls and gates. The real defense should come from a Domain's Player Citizens.

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I dunno it just seems to me what with your lower threshold and now this that you're trying to get a domain but don't want to work for it...

I'm just curious what's next to nerf domain take overs on your behalf... :P

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Cool story bro :]

Care to elaborate on how reducing the player threshold due to lack of players is reducing my workload?

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I agree and disagree with dean. Armies need a SLIGHT debuff as Kumog suggested. Slowling wittling (spell check :P) it down to work off the rough edges will provide a more effective means of fixing the problem.

Edit: Oh and Cea, sometimes things like this are a coincidence, and not always for ones own benefit. You think someone would have noticed something like this being unbalanced early on when domain takeovers require the mere killing of one guard? ;)

Not until the circumstances line up for things like this to be tested and noticed can anything be done about it. And dont pull out the "you're trying to help them cuz they're your allies" card. Cuz thats completely not the case.

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Grim, we've had full armies ever since like level 22. I've taken a domain with an army at like level 25. So yeah, no one seemed to notice then...

And Dean, your post to reduce threshold is logical yeah, but your intent was so you'd have a chance at a domain. That's what all our intents are when we suggest it (I've done it too).

But now I guess you realize you're not strong enough to take a domain as it is so you're trying to get armies nerfed. Which is understandable, you've never been an honorable person.

I just don't find logic in nerfing armies in half almost simply because you can't beat up a few elves.

I'd also point out how we shouldn't bother with a "dead" version or make changes to FFO as you all seem to love pointing out but I can't because if I'm not mistaken, armies carry over to Terulia too... xD



I dunno I just hate super nerfing shit because people can't play the game well. I've always been against huge nerfs and this one is no different...

Oh well, good luck bothering Gaku over AIM with it. As if I care I guess, I already destroyed this version of FFO. xD

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the main idea is an army is supplemental only.

ok.

we can make armies like they used to be. killable outside towns, without a threshold etc if we reduce the cost of the units making them just an additional defensive force instead of THE main defense.

this way without reducing their stats, we make them defeatable with a normal party if they're the only defense but still a challenge for a small group of players.

by a cost reduction, i mean a major one. if an army unit can be killed easily (which they can during an attack) they shouldnt cost 25k to replace.

the current costs of 10k/soldier, 15k/rangers, and 25k/mage can be reduced to 5k/soldier, 7.5k/ranger, and 10k/mage.

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I honestly believe that if the military was made how it used to be, before any buffs (like at the beginning of last hosting), and made a lot cheaper, it would be fine. That way, you can still build them up, but they can't hold a domain alone.

Buffing the military was never even considered or done until one group with 20+ people capped attacked a domain. A group that size shouldn't have any trouble against just about any domain being held by three lower level people.

The bottom line is that, as was pointed out, armies should be supplemental. The threshold is there to ensure that domains don't get taken when no defenders are on. If you don't want to lose your domain, defend it yourself.

Also if this suggestion goes into effect, the threshold needs to be raised again.

On a side note, I find it funny that last hosting Dean defended the buff, while now that it hurts him hes fighting against it...

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Armies are expensive as Hell. They gave us trouble but we wiped out some already before level cap was even at 30. I don't know about armies being okay defending towns by themselves, but I can argue back that a few people shouldn't be able to take a domain either. Get better or get more people.

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I was with the party that tried to take down sankora mages were dealing 300-400 per pop rangers werent that bad and we didnt face any soldiers the mages dealing 300-400 dmg was the kicker when u have 6 mages spamming you with tier 2 spells its just not gonna work especially if u HAVE TO BE on a tile to kill them. I think instead of a Debuff maybe make it to where you dont have to be on a tile to kill said armies I think that will go a long way and you could instill a 10-15% debuff so its not nuking the stats of the army.

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Mages getting a low reduction in magic damage output would make things less impossible for lower-levels but as for soldiers and rangers I like to believe that they're fine.

You have to remember about the HP and MP of those guys, they're still NPCs with regular AI's. They can always be taken advantage of, which is the smartest way to fight them. Anyways, soldiers aren't that threatening, so while this is a suggestion topic for armies, I'd suggest letting soldiers be able to throw enemies like guards can to avoid people using a choke-hold that somehow holds off an entire army of NPCs so they're fought one at a time. :p

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Its simple, really. Nerf them back to how they were pre-buffs, and decrease their cost by 75%. If you want to keep your domains, play the game. There should never be a situation where a group of players can outdo everyone else and then go play some other game and leave it impossible for anyone to take their domains. Is this an active game or a passive game?

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Just because people say it's too hard to take doesn't mean it's true. If you have enough people you can at least do damage. If you can't take the domain the first strike, you can get rid of some army members, lower their morale so town income goes down, and if the people in charge aren't around, then the army isn't going to recover either.

Honestly this is just Dean not wanting to work hard to take a domain over, that's all. There are plenty of ways to go about beating the army that are easy enough anyways, just takes more thinking than "durr hurr attack attack".

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